Cello amplification

Hello everybody,

Could someone help me with tips on cello amplification? Usually I play "unplugged" (classical, tango, renaissance), but I'll be playing with some amplified guitars (irish bouzouki, Weissenborn) and I figure I'll need a little help. The guitarist will help me with the amplifier/loudspeaker/pedal part, but I have no idea how to best pick up the sound on my cello.

Thanks in advance,
Tormod Dalen


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Get a pickup!

There are many pickups out there that you can use. I got a custom crafted one on ebay that works well. You may also need a preamp to go along with it. The seller is really nice, and if you like, I can get his email for you. They usually cost around 25-30 bucks. Others, like Fishman brand, are in the 90s-120s range. Don't know what the difference is, though. Maybe the fishman has a built in preamp.

Zen

try this website for info

http://erikfriedlander.com/livesound.htm

I use a Realist pickup and bass amp.

I have a cool little

I have a cool little multi-effects box that I use, too. It's a Zoom 506II for bass. There's also the 505 for guitar. Really fun to play around with!

Or... Get a Mic!

Although more expensive, a descent condenser microphone will recreate the cello's sound more accurately (if you want that). It gets more difficult when playing at high levels as they are more prone to feedback.

RichT

pickups and preamps

Hi,

Actually, the Fishman C100 cello pickup doesn't have a built-in anything. I use it because I've figured out the math to make it sound okay, and from my shopping around, a pickup is a pickup -- it's your preamp that really makes the difference. (There are some exceptions -- like the Schertlers, but I won't blah blah about why I don't use them.)

The Fishman really won't work without a preamp -- it has a 10Mohm impedence, which means it has a really, really low signal. So if you plug it straight into an amp or a mixing board all the bass frequencies will be low and the whole signal will be really quiet -- it's a very tinny sound. You can get one of the cheap-o plastic preamps that Fishman or LR Baggs or Barcus Berry sells to go with their pickups, and their preamps will make your signal more usable, but for what they are, they are generally way overpriced and don't sound so hot. There are a million good preamp options in the music market made by companies that specialize in compression and preamplification.

This is kind of a pricey setup, but it works for me: when I am playing a bigger hall I generally use just the cheap Fishman C100 (I refuse to use a pickup that requires me modifying my cello). I plug it into a DI box to lower the impedence a little bit, then plug it into my Presonus Eureka mic preamp (which is set to take a 2Mohm input maximum, thus that DI box before it even hits the preamp stage). The Eureka has a sweet compressor -- which is the most important preamp stage when dealing with a cello's signal -- and a nice parametric equalizer so I can dial out feedback frequencies.

I used to play a Fender bassman and I used to use a tube preamp (an ART) but I think tubes are just too unpredictable with the cello's mass of sound, so some shows and some songs in some keys would give me major grief on stage. It doesn't look as cool aesthetically speaking on stage, but I'll take the digital compression over tube compression any day now because I get more control over it. Now I play through a solid state Ampeg BA210: 200 watts, 2x10 combo. That setup is very loud, clean and sounds like a cello (rather than a nasally guitar) in even the loudest situations.

I hope that helps,
Doug

http://brightredpaper.com

pick-up/amp

have been using a Baggs pickup with a Trace Elliot Acoustic amp. the TE has a built in preamp channel with some effects and EQ and a DI out ( it also has another channel without preamp) It sounds great for low level amplification and is relatively small, light and portable. For louder shows I run out of the amp to the board and turn off the amp speakers- although sometimes it is nice to have because it works as my own personal "cello only" monitor that I can control from stage for those times when you just can hear well enough through monitors for playing in tune!

so really there are two different animals with differnt solutions - playing where you just need a little boost and playing in a fully electric loud scene....so far the system I am using has bridged that gap reasonably well though I am still collecting info on rack preamps so I can start putting together a good stage setup for electric shows...

will check into the Eureka mentioned above.... looking for a good basic preamp / compressor without bells and whistles - already have an EQ and a Lexicon processor in a rack waiting!

Cello amplification!

If you want you can read an interview I just gave on this topic. www.drunkenmirmaid.com The acoustic cello is very hard to amplify well. All the transducer pickups fishman c100 etc. to my ear sound horrible. We must not settle for that scratchy, honky, sound. (That's after EQ of course!) After years of experimenting I use the AKG C 411, contact condenser microphone, placed one fingers distance above the bridge on the C string side. This actually sounds like a cello and is much less prone to feedback than a traditional microphone. It also takes to distortion/effects very well. I use this mic with a bodypack transmitter clipped onto the stings below the bridge, so I can be wireless (I play standing up). After a little EQ and some effects I am very happy with the sound. Now if you want just a little more breath and depth to the sound, and you have a low stage volume, you can attach an AKG 419 gooseneck to the tailpiece and aim the mic at the lower circle of the a-string f hole. This gives all the warm juicy overtones that we are used to and you can adjust the bass using the proximity effect. Just move the mic closer to the hole to get more bass, the reverse for less. OK, lets get really snobby. To really mic a cello, (studio, live recorded performance etc.) I suggest using a Neumann M149 (or a U87 will work) at least 5 feet from the cello. I personally have had great results placing the mic very close to the floor 1 ft. Just make sure you have a little carpet to place in front of the cello to dampen the slap back echo from the floor. Then I usually use a pair of Schoeps small diaphragm condensers as room/boundary mics (414s will work as well). For studio pre's I use an Avaloln 737 for the Neumann and a True Systems pre for the Schoeps. As far as pre's for the live rig the wireless transmitter for the AKG c411 has a preamp in it (which also provides phantom power). Going wired, just make sure you don't go too cheap. You're signal is only as good as it's weakest link. Mackie, Presonus, Soundcraft, FocusRite Platinum, Allen&Heath all make very good pre's. 9 times out of 10 the boards (mixer) pre's should be fine. Which comes to my final recommendation. I much prefer running the cello through the mixer and PA. It is nearly impossible to fill a room/compete with a drummer with just an amp onstage, with out feedback. Using the PA places your main source of signal in front of the band which greatly reduces this problem. Just make sure you have a good PA. I am VERY happy with my Mackie SRM450, handles the cello beautifully. If your still having problems with feedback, try an Ashley 31 band graphic EQ. It's good to have something like this, you never know, the resonant frequency of the room just might be your wolftone (the most prone to feedback, usually around 100Hz depending on your cello). I am demoing a Sabine feedback eliminator next week, I'll let you know. For monitoring you can use a small instrument amp or use the wedges that came with the PA, or if you're daring, try wireless in-ears. Shure has a great line. These are perfect for cellists, no feedback; you can adjust your mix of the band/your cello. Absolutely the best way to go for cello, and if you ever "make it big" you will be already used to the technology. Best of Luck, Alfred
www.alfredjamesband.com

cello pickup

Hi,
I use a Barcus-Barry cello pickup (can't remember the model # though right now) which screws onto the bridge and works well. The only thing is that the pre-amp needs to be adhered to the cello as well, through velcro. It could ruin your cello finish so you may want to adhere it to the tailpiece if possible. I have a crappy cello so I just attached it to my cello front. I've had this for about 2 years and like it ok, but I am in the market for an electric cello that I can be mobile with. I play standing up but would love to get a 6-string electric that I can walk around with...I'm even toying with modifying an electric bass so I can work that way, but it's up in the air now. I also use a Zoom guitar processor which makes the sound fun, but if you process your sound, an electric instrument may be better unless you have a great monitor because you tend to hear the acoustic sound from your direct playing and not the processed sound. I'm always open to new suggestions myself...

I saw a video a guy put up

I saw a video a guy put up about how to run your cello through a sound system, and he expirements ith the different ways (free).

"Make it Count"

"The music may stop now and then, But the the strings will remain forever..." -anonomous

i dunno if you're looking

i dunno if you're looking for a cheap but good version or that you have money to spare...either way it will depend on your cello. if its a crappy one then you have many options that would be able to amplify relatively well to a background of loud noise..
i have a spare solid cello and i have used fishmans but the output signal on that is bad, and for that price its a waste of money..the preamp is bulky and not the best you can get.i tried a double transducer for a bass guitar which plonks itself just below thst bridge..gives out good bass and treble signal.its 15 squiders and thats a bargain!!plus with a pickup booster you can get from the guitar centre in usa for not much and you've got prettyt much a good set up..just need a nice amp for your own sanity and you're away :)most sound people have commented that the sound was the best they've ever heard a cello sound on stage....which is always a bonus.just accept the comments it'll be fine!

Pick-Up

I got the Shadow cello pick up yesterday from my local cello shop. It comes with a preamp which is really nice cause I can adjust the volume and tone easily. I will play tonight and have to see how it sounds like on stage with other electric guitar and bass going on.
Here is the website of the pick up:
http://www.shadow-electronics.com/viewpro.html?id=&loc=US
(I have a bass amp and monster cable too.)

Cello pick-up

Hi everyone
I use Shadow pick-up for a year now and I was quite satisfied with it. Now we (band) have rather bigger projects on our mind and I'm looking for something better.
Could anyone send link to Barcus Barry homepage. I can't find it anywhere. Our band plays symphometal and I need to check Barcus Barry because I heard that it goes really good to this kind of music.
Thank you all

Cello pick-up

Hi! I already found the website so thanks anyway